Catholics, get your heads out of the sand! This is the most dangerous threat to the Catholic Church since Arius.
Cardinals and Bishops, will you stand by and allow this?
You will go to Hell.
So will Bergoglio!
https://www.lifesitenews.com/news/pope-spoke-of-decentralizing-decisions-on-communion-for-divorced-remarried
Pope spoke of ‘decentralizing’ decisions on Communion for divorced/remarried: Polish bishops’ head
KRAKOW, Poland, July 29, 2016 (LifeSiteNews) – The head of the Polish bishops conference says that in a private meeting this week Pope Francis held with the country’s bishops, he spoke of allowing local bishops conferences to make decisions about the controversial practice of giving Communion to those who are divorced and remarried.
“The Holy Father says that general laws are very hard to enforce in each country, and so he speaks about decentralization,” Archbishop Stanislaw Gadecki told reporters after a July 27 closed-door meeting with the Pope in Krakow. The pope had traveled to Poland for World Youth Day.
The pope related that in a decentralized Church, bishops’ conferences “might on their own initiative not only interpret papal encyclicals, but also looking at their own cultural situation, might approach some specific issues in an appropriate manner,” Gadecki said.
19 comments:
"Catholics, get your heads out of the sand! This is the most dangerous threat to the Catholic Church since Arius."
AMEN! AMEN! AMEN!
"Jorge Bergoglio affirms his intent to undermine the very nature of the Catholic Church!"
AMEN! AMEN! AMEN!
But why are we surprised? We have known of their intentions since Alta Vendita!
Bergoglio wears the torch insignia of the uber beast on his chest!
Are we blind? Do we not see it?
The Vicar of Christ undermines the Church of Christ - but remains the Vicar of Christ?
(The Lord is very tolerant - I would have fired him on the spot!)
Christ built His Church on a clod of shifting sand - not a rock?
The NWO church is Infallible, Indefectible and faithfully guards the Deposit of Faith handed down since the Apostles?
The Unity of Christ's Church resides in Bergoglio?
The Gates of Hell (heretics) have prevailed?
Christ has taken leave of absence from His Church?
The NWO church is the Catholic Church?
If lucifer were to manifest materially and Bergoglio were to fall down in adoration at his feet, some "Catholics" would still insist that he is a true pope and that the NWO church is the Catholic Church! None are so blind as the willfully blind!
Vatican I and St. Robert might have determined and declared that there has never been an heretical Pope in the history of the Church and St. Robert might have seen this fact as a sign from Heaven that such a thing - an heretical Pope - was not possible, but it just goes to show - anybody can make mistakes, because we have a live, heretical true Pope!?
Francis the Destroyer making a mess.
So we are now definitely NOT the One Holy Catholic & Apostolic Church anymore just another Protestant cult added to the countless other denominations/cults within that category commenced by Martin Luther five hundred years ago. It's no wonder the commemorative arrangements are going ahead with great speed!
SSPX take note - we'll need you to rebuild Christ's Church on earth if things turn out the way was expect them to.
There is statement by St. Thomas that goes something like this: the identify of a being is dependent on it's unity. According to this axiom the Catholic Church will cease to exist if multiple Bishop's conferences can interpret doctrine. It will become effectively Protestant as it has been trending for many years.
Everything that I read about that he is doing at WYD...it reminds me of the Evangelicals. Especially the guitar scene during the exposition of the Blessed Sacrament.
It is not Catholic!
We are living in the Twilight Zone and it's hard to get my head around it!
He has certainly fallen..let's pray very much to Our Lady that he And his minions will repent otherwise they will not be able to get up.
Vox, are we certain that Lifesite's claim is correct? I have not found any reports that confirmed Lifestite's claim about Archbishop Stanislaw Gadecki's supposed remarks. If Lifetsite's claim is correct, then the story in question would be worldwide news.
Something is not right about Lifesite's claim. In fact, numerous reports about Archbishop Stanislaw Gadecki's remarks contradict dramatically Lifesite's claim.
Examples: Church Militant's report on Archbishop Stanislaw Gadecki's comments is 100 percent opposite of Lifesite's report. The same applies to Nation Catholic Register's report on Archbishop Stanislaw Gadecki's statements.
Church Militant:
Polish Bishops: No Communion to Remarried Divorcees
Announcement comes shortly after bishops met privately with Pope Francis in Krakow
KRAKOW (ChurchMilitant.com) - The bishops of Poland are reaffirming that remarried divorcees cannot receive Holy Communion. Archbishop Stanislaw Gadecki, head of the Polish bishops conference, made the announcement Wednesday evening to the press after the bishops met privately with Pope Francis earlier in the day.
The archbishop noted that the meeting with the Pope was "very warm" and "he listened to the bishops." One of four questions brought up at the meeting was the Holy Father's apostolic exhortation "Amoris Laetitia" and its need for clarification.
Archbishop Gadecki replied that the Polish bishops believe the document reflected their "more conservative proposal" they voiced during last year's Synod on the Family to "retain the truth of the Gospel" regarding the inability of remarried divorcees to receive the sacraments. Gadecki emphasized, "We cannot deliberately overstep Christ's precept against divorce."
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1. His Holiness Pope Francis and the Polish bishop experienced a "very warm" meeting with each other.
2. Archbishop Stanislaw Gadecki declared that Amoris Laetitia "reflected their "more conservative proposal" they voiced during last year's Synod on the Family to "retain the truth of the Gospel" regarding the inability of remarried divorcees to receive the sacraments.
Vox, Archbishop Stanislaw Gadecki's comments are 100 percent opposed to the notion that that Pope Francis "affirms his (Pope Francis') intent to undermine the very nature of the Catholic Church!"
Again, Archbishop Stanislaw Gadecki declared that Amoris Laetitia reflects the Polish bishops' teaching that unrepentant divorced and remarried Catholics are free to "receive the Sacraments."
Vox, it is clear from the Church Militant report that Lifesite misrepresented Archbishop Stanislaw Gadecki's comments.
Pax.
Mark Thomas
Peter Lamb. Well said Peter. We need more Savonarolas like yourself. Hope a few Cardinals and Bishops will say what you said. But they would be dismissed as out of touch. Divine intervention might get some attention. We Catholics are not much different that the Jews before Christ--way off the track.
Vox, here is National Catholic Register's report on Archbishop Stanislaw Gadecki's press conference and comments. National Catholic Register's report contradicts the claim that Amoris Laetitia has opened the door to Holy Communion for unrepentant divorced and remarried Catholics.
-- Head of Polish Bishops: Pope Francis Listened to Us
"Despite some reports expecting Pope Francis to criticize Polish bishops on their approach to immigration and other issues at tonight’s meeting in Krakow, the atmosphere was “very warm” and the Pope listened to their concerns, the president of the Polish bishops’ conference has said."
"One of those concerns relates to ambiguous passages in his post-synodal apostolic exhortation Amoris Laetitia and the need for their clarification — a matter that the bishops raised with the Pope, according to sources."
"Asked whether the bishops and the Pope discussed Amoris Laetitia, the president of the Polish bishops’ conference said that as far as he and his fellow bishops were concerned, the document took into account their “more conservative proposal” during the synod which was to “retain the truth of the Gospel” when relating to admission to the sacraments of remarried divorcees. “We cannot deliberately overstep Christ’s precept against divorce,” he said."
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1. National Catholic Register's report on Archbishop Stanislaw Gadecki's press conference reflects the very positive Church Militant (as well as additional news media outlets) report about the meeting between His Holiness Pope Francis and the Polish bishops.
2. Contrary to contrived reports days ago that Pope Francis and the Polish bishops would experience a hostile meeting, Archbishop Stanislaw Gadecki declared that the meeting was "very warm."
3. Archbishop Stanislaw Gadecki declared that Amoris Laetitia reflected the Polish Bishops' refusal to permit (unrepentant) divorced and remarried Catholics to receive Holy Communion.
4. Archbishop Stanislaw Gadecki declared that he and the Polish bishops uphold the following:
Amoris Laetitia reflects "conservative" teaching and "retains the truth of the Gospel."
Pax.
Mark Thomas
What, according to the Church, are the function of a true Pope? According to the theologians, the Pope is "one hierarchical person with our Lord." This being so, when he speaks within his function, it is our Lord who teaches, governs and sanctifies. These are the areas of the Pope's authority; the basis of his triple crown, the Tiara, (which Paul VI gave away). In so far as he appoints his Bishops and provides Jurisdiction, he is governing; in declaring the Novus Ordo Missae to be the "normative" mass, he is sanctifying; in declaring the documents of Vatican II to be the Supreme form of the Magisterium, he is teaching.
Yet,those who recognize the post-Conciliar “popes” to be a true and valid Popes, have no problem in disobeying them when said popes say things which they do not like, or agree with. Salza, Matt, Ferrara, Bp. Fellay and many others, are happy to guide us as to when we should, or should not follow the teachings of the conciliar popes. Those willing to guide us down an essentially Protestant path, are legion.
However, refusing to accept the teaching of a Pope when he speaks within his function as the spokesperson for Christ, is a rejection of Christ’s teaching – that is if the Pope concerned is a true Pope. Such is the worst form of disobedience and a rejection of the truth. It is called heresy, schism, or apostasy.
We, as Catholics, have an obligation to obey the Pope who speaks in persona Christi. Those who recognise the conciliar popes have a dilemma. If they obey the conciliar popes, they must give up their Catholic Faith. Hence it is that all sorts of solutions are proposed (R&R etc.) – solutions that avoid recognizing the real issue. The bottom line is one cannot obey these individuals and remain Catholic. One can only conclude that they have no authority – that they do not speak as one hierarchical person with Christ. It matters little how one labels them – anti-popes, usurpers, materialiter popes, or no popes at all. The bottom line is that they have no authority to speak in Christ’s name.
The argument that the Remnant will always have a living Pope with it is has no basis in fact, or Catholic theology. It is pure opinion – indeed as is the claim that if there is no pope, there is no Church. That the Church continues to exist despite the absence – temporary – of a Pope in no way denies the declaration of Vatican I that the SUCCESSION of Peter will be perpetual, but there is no specification, or limitation of the durations of the interregna between Popes. Our Lord is visiting punishment for our sins upon us and He will decide how long this chastisement will last. However, we do know that it will end and then the next true Pope will reign.
We know that in the "end times" only a Remnant will remain Catholic, and obviously, it is with this remnant that God will remain. These Scriptural statements are verified by the fact that throughout the world there are a small but significant number of traditional Catholics who reject the post-Conciliar Church, and retain the true Catholic Faith. As Catherine Emerick said, if there is only one Catholic left at the end, the Catholic Church will be found in him.
Thank you for defending the teachings of Jesus and sharing the truth of the Gospel.
https://www.ncregister.com/blog/edward-pentin/head-of-polish-bishops-pope-francis-listened-to-us
Mark, the above is the link.
Here is the quote from NCRegister:
"He said the Pope believes “that general laws are very hard to enforce in each country, and so he speaks about decentralization.” He noted that bishops’ conferences “might on their own initiative not only interpret papal encyclicals, but also looking at their own cultural situation, might approach some specific issues in an appropriate manner.”
This is what is quoted in LifeSiteNews, it is accurate.
This is not Catholic. The intent of Francis, is clear, decentralisation and national conferences deciding what works for them.
This is not Catholic no matter how anyone tries to spin it.
It is consistent with his address after the Synod and in Amoris Laetitia.
it is unacceptable and it is heresy.
Re: Vox comment: "This is not Catholic. The intent of Francis, is clear, decentralisation and national conferences deciding what works for them."
What this means is the doctrinal end of authority and unity in the Catholic Church which equates to the Catholic Church becoming Protestant.
Vox, I read the quote from Archbishop Stanislaw Gadecki. There isn't one shred of the quote that is sinister, as Lifesite implied.
Archbishop Stanislaw Gadecki said: "This is why he speaks about decentralisation, so that a bishops’ conference in a particular country can formulate its own perspective, not only in how it applies papal directives, but also in finding the right solutions in its own situation."
There isn't anything in that quote that suggests even remotely that Amoris Laetitia is heretical...not a word about the document having opened the door to Holy Communion for unrepentant divorced and remarried Catholics.
Vox, what is undeniable is that Archbishop Stanislaw Gadecki declared that...
1. Pope Francis and the Polish bishops conducted a "very warm" meeting.
2. The Polish bishops will deny Holy Communion to unrepentant divorced and remarried Catholics.
3. Amoris Laetitia is a "conservative" document that upholds the Church's, and, of course, the Polish bishops' teaching that unrepentant divorced and remarried Catholics are not permitted to receive Holy Communion.
That is what Archbishop Stanislaw Gadecki said.
Pax.
Mark Thomas
Vox, here is the quote from National Catholic Register in regard to Archbishop
Stanisław Gądecki' comments on the Polish bishops' meeting with His Holiness Pope Francis:
https://www.ncregister.com/blog/edward-pentin/head-of-polish-bishops-pope-francis-listened-to-us
"Asked whether the bishops and the Pope discussed Amoris Laetitia, the president of the Polish bishops’ conference said that as far as he and his fellow bishops were concerned, the document took into account their “more conservative proposal” during the synod which was to “retain the truth of the Gospel” when relating to admission to the sacraments of remarried divorcees. “We cannot deliberately overstep Christ’s precept against divorce,” he said."
Vox, it is undeniable that Archbishop Stanisław Gądecki, President of the Polish Bishops Conference, comments are 100 percent opposite the claim that Amoris Laetitia has opened the door to Holy Communion for unrepentant divorced and remarried Catholics.
1. Archbishop Stanisław Gądecki declared that Amoris Laetitia reflected the Polish bishops' refusal to allow unrepentant divorced and remarried Catholics to receive Holy Communion.
2. Archbishop Stanisław Gądecki declared that Amoris Laetitia has retained "the truth of the Gospel" as the document does not permit admission to the sacraments of unrepentant remarried divorcees.
Pax.
Mark Thomas
Girolamo Savonarola (1452-1498), Dominican monk famous for his fierce opposition to moral license and Church corruption.
Thanks Mike! :)
When the Medici were expelled from the city of Florence in 1494, he instituted a severely puritanical republic, but lost the citizens' support after being excommunicated in 1497. He was hanged and burned as a heretic.
You just meant the first bit, hey Mike? :)
Mark,
1. Did both LifeSiteNews and NCRegister not state the same quote?
2. Is this devolution on the interpretation of doctrine not heretical?
3. Did Bergoglio not promte this very same thing at the Synod and in AL?
It is not Catholic!
Vox, I don't dispute at all your quote from the Archbishop in regard to decentralization. I wish to make clear that I don't dispute that.
Vox, what I question is the spin that Lifesite placed upon Archbishop Stanislaw Gadecki's comment about decentralization. Lifesite claimed:
-- Pope spoke of ‘decentralizing’ decisions on Communion for divorced/remarried: Polish bishops’ head
KRAKOW, Poland, July 29, 2016 (LifeSiteNews) – "The head of the Polish bishops conference says that in a private meeting this week Pope Francis held with the country’s bishops, he spoke of allowing local bishops conferences to make decisions about the controversial practice of giving Communion to those who are divorced and remarried."
Vox, where is that claim from Archbishop Gadecki? I have not found that claim reported anywhere except on Lifesite. If that quote from Archbishop Gadecki exists, then please, I would like to see that quote.
Vox, all that I'm saying is that Lifesite's spin/claim is contrary to Archbishop Gadecki's statement that Amoris Laetitia is 100 percent in line with the Polish bishops' "more conservative proposal" during the synod which was to "retain the truth of the Gospel" when relating to admission to the sacraments of remarried divorcees. "We cannot deliberately overstep Christ’s precept against divorce,” he said."
Again, I ask, how could Lifesite claim that Pope Francis made it clear to the Polish bishops that Amoris Laetitia has opened the door to communion for adulterers when Archbishop Gadecki declared that following the Polish bishops' meeting with Pope Francis:
1. Amoris Laetitia reflects the Polish bishops' "conservative" approach to upholding Church teaching.
2. Pope Francis and Amoris Laetitia "retain the truth of the Gospel", which the Polish bishops uphold, in regard to the admission to the sacraments of remarried divorcees.
Vox, again, those quotations are Archbishop Gadecki's very words. They differ 100 percent from Lifesite's spin.
Pax.
Mark Thomas
Mark Thomas -
Pope Francis speaks out of both sides of his mouth. The others speaking for Pope Francis with his stamp of approval range from the likes of Kasper to Spadaro to Shonborn, the latter who according to Francis is the ultimate interpreter of Amoris. They've already spilled the beans about the decentralization plans. Germany gets to do what they want. The Africans can get lost and keep their mouths shut. Different pastoral needs for different cows & pastures.
The Polish Bishops alongside others like Burke etc. try to pretend the Pope is traditional and that heretical documents like Amoris are either 'traditional' or 'not part of the deposit of faith and ought to be brushed under the carpet.' They attempt to do this to avoid scandal. It's like watching the U.S. Democrats trying to cover up for Hillary Clinton. Everyone can clearly see that Gadecki's words that you quote there are empty PR to vainly try to cover for the character of the present Pope. He might as well claim that like the U.S. Democrats that the Vladimir Putin is trying to break up the Church. That the Russians are hacking the Vatican's personal computers to insert heresy into Good Traditional Pope Francis' encyclicals without him knowing about it because he was busy saying the Traditional Mass with his back turned to the computer screen.
There is no spin on LifeSite's part. They're telling you precisely what Pope Francis has always signaled he intends to do, and what all his openly heretical buddies are openly saying he supports by speaking for him without correction.
Don't be thick by trying to strain the gnats from various quotations. Step back and look at the full picture.
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